This is a topic which causes a lot of controversy, but I think it is pretty interesting. The definition of cultural appropriation that I was given is “using things from a culture which isn’t your culture particularly without showing respect for that culture”
It’s the subject the debate team are using at college so I would like to see what you all think.
Cultural what now?
This
There was a whole giant thing on the other forums about how people were being disrespectful by using hairstyles from for example, African culture, on white characters, and then it turned into a debate about cultural appropriation. Then some people said, ‘well, it’s not disrespectful because what if you just want to wear it because it’s cute? How is saying it’s cute disrespectful?’ And then people said ‘well it’s not disrespectful but it is if they go and then claim that hairstyle is from their own culture’.
Sorry for the random structure of this, but just some ideas on what to talk about ^^
The definition:
1. Why black cultural hairstyles are not/never “just hair”:
2. Why hair straightening is not CA:
3.a. Why talking about CA is not/never been about banning people from participating in marginalised groups’ cultures:
3.b. My personal opinion:
4. Why black women or any other marginalised group may choose not to engage in cultural exchanges:
I believe it definitely exists. And it’s a bit of a problem too. actually, huge problem. like blackfishing
Cultural appropriation definitely exists…there is a huge difference between appropriating and appreciating a culture. I just don’t understand why people think it’s racist of a white woman to wear a kimono if she appreciates Japanese culture, I do agree that you don’t have to be Japanese to wear a kimono but just as long as you don’t make fun of it with stuff like “Oh look at me, I’m wearing a kimono and I’m half Japanese” making these weird “Asian” eyes thing (if you get what I’m talking about).
Remember a girl named Keziah who wore a Cheongsam as a prom dress and she got a lot of hate for it? I felt really bad for that girl because she looked amazing in that dress and she was nowhere being racist or appropriating the culture. There were some white people that did attack her for being “racist” when they were the ones being racist. Even one Asian guy attacked her for it but at least he got called out for it.
Sometimes, cultural clothing can be sexualised as I can see where people are coming from with that. Like I’ve already stated on why I would never want to wear salwar kameez/sari/lengha due to these painful memories that I don’t want to relive; especially when I felt objectified.
I don’t really see anything wrong with people want to learn about other cultures as long as they don’t disrespect them but I do have a problem with people that do blackfishing…I can agree that it’s disgusting and disrespectful.
The Asian guy was really rude. He said something like “My culture is not your $%#/& prom dress” or something like that. If you want to educate someone, there’s no need to be rude about it.
Exactly! That was so petty of him to attack her over her dress, it wasn’t like she was making these stupid faces.
It definitely exists.
I’m sure some of the new users will have opinions on this.
What do you guys think?
People living now didn’t create the culture they were born into. Period. You can’t own something you didn’t create, and being disrespectful about anything, not just culture, makes you a jerk.
My opinion is that sharing cultures and ideas makes us stronger as a human race and improves integration.
HOWEVER
Anyone who doesn’t give the credit where it is due is appropriating. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with using elements of other cultures, but you’ve gotta be clear that you got them from another culture and not try to act like you made them yourself
Lately, I’ve been hearing the term ‘culture vulture’ being used.
But what exactly is a ‘culture vulture’? Where do we draw the line between a person appreciating and wanting to participate in customs or styles belonging to a culture that isn’t theirs, and appropriation? Does anyone have any examples of this?
I feel like this fails to take into account that not all cultures are treated equally. For something to be considered cultural appropriation it must be a dominant group taking from an oppressed group. Every white person with locs (for instance) can give black culture credit for that hair style but it won’t help black people with locs suddenly become respected in school, the work place, or just walking down the street. The offense people feel is not “you took credit for something my culture invented”, it’s “you love our culture but hate us.”, “you make money and are complimented on things we are disparaged for.”, “you eat our food, listen to our music, do our dances, wear styles we came up with but we are still below you”.
A “Culture vulture” is the label given to people who habitually practice cultural appropriation, like The Kardashians, Iggy Azalea, Arianna Grande, Bruno Mars, Miley Cyrus, a lot of black Americans consider Drake a culture vulture, the list goes on. There is no hard line, I think we get passed it by working to create an equitable world in which cultural appropriation can’t exist because no culture has dominion over another.
I disagree. I believe that we can achieve respect via normalisation. I, as a mixed race woman, don’t really know of anyone who feels pain when they see a white person with dreadlocks. In fact, from my experience, it tends to be more black people opening a dialogue about the fact that they are treated badly for the same hairstyles, and then others getting offended on their behalf. So I don’t think it’s fair to say that not giving credit is not where the pain comes from. Seeing fashion designers, for example, take credit for Indian clothing or Jamaican hairstyles is frustrating and painful for me.
In my opinion, cultural exchange is part of a long process to raising the status of the minority culture. It’s a long process, though, and penalising those who would like to embrace and appreciate the culture because they do it the wrong way ultimately goes against that.
I think it’s much more productive to say “I’ve noticed you’re wearing this. This is part of my culture and here’s a little bit about the history. I love that you love it”. Why? White fragility really does make white people push back and can be detrimental to a lot of causes. I know we shouldn’t pander to white fragility, but a lot of white people respond better to hearing about other cultures and struggles through other white people, so it’s a good idea to take advantage of that.
I think it’s important to, instead of saying “cultural appropriation”, point out times when minorities are treated badly for aspects of their culture that white people are praised for. In my opinion, pointing out hypocrisy is a lot more productive than barring people from being inspired by other cultures. That’s where giving credit where it’s due comes from. If the people from dominant cultures embrace and share the roots of the things they’re inspired by, it opens up a dialogue regarding why minorities are treated badly for doing the same. Otherwise? We don’t get the exposure we deserve. I think we should use the current cultural environment to our advantage rather than pushing against it.
Oh, I know, and I agree that in interpersonal situations hostility and name calling are antithetical to your goal but I don’t believe in coddling white fragility and I think we should call things what they are.
What you’re suggesting works on an individual level, a personal level, your friends, your neighbors, your coworkers, but it does nothing to address the truths of institutional injustice and oppression that lead to this symptom in the first place.
Normalization just means something gets completely removed from its original cultural context, absorbed into white culture its roots quickly forgotten and I don’t think it matters how much you try to educate individuals, because systemically white is the default. The original culture, in a lot of cases, then gets shut out of their own creation.
Look at rock n’ roll, the earliest pioneers and influencers being Black Americans in the 1940’s and 50’s, just 30 years later after the death of Jimi Hendrix he was describes as “a black man in the alien world of rock”. Chuck Berry’s records had not disappeared, Sister Rossetta Tharp was not forgotten, Arthur Crudup could not have been that distant of a memory, and yet just a few decades later Jimi was an “other” in the music his culture created.
I disagree with this. Normalisation is the process of removing stigma from something and allowing it to flourish without seeming “weird” or “exotic”. I think that’s something that needs to happen in order for cultures to be accepted and embraced.
The thing is: the truths of institutional injustice and oppression aren’t fought by gatekeeping, in my opinion. Our society is made up of a network of individuals with unique, personal relationships. It is through this interpersonal method and mass education that we can make true change. As with the Civil Rights Movement in the 60s, what white people need is to be introduced to the plights of minorities in a way that is understandable to them. In a way that elicits empathy.
The aim isn’t to coddle white fragility, but rather to acknowledge that white people are the dominant group at the moment and use that as a springboard to see real change
Like I said this is not what actually ends up happening because white is the norm. White people love embracing and excepting other cultures they’ve been doing it for generations, just without the people that are originally apart of them. Instead of being weird and exotic it’s cool, commodifiable and now part of every day white culture. I also think you’re seriously overestimating people, the strong never want to give up their privileges (shout out to The First Man). They all heard the children in cages, children descended from the Nahua the people of the land who traveled freely before colonists created boarders, and they felt sad for a bit - maybe - and then went back to eating their Taco Bell.
Just to chip in a small bit, it shouldn’t be the job of the oppressed to educate the oppressor about their oppression. If a white person genuinely wanted to help achieve racial equality and racial equality then it shouldn’t be down to a POC to explain racism in a palatable way for them. They should be actively trying to dismantle racism because they themselves think it’s wrong, and it shouldn’t take a nice POC for them to believe that other races deserve basic human rights, including wearing their hair in it’s natural state without being banned and/or discriminated for doing so.