Healthcare: Private or Free?

As you might have seen from our calendar, I scheduled a discussion for today! I thought it would be nice to discuss political and social issues every fortnight. It’s something that sets us apart from other forums (that we can actually get political), so why not embrace it?

So my question for this fortnight is:

What do you think of healthcare? Should it be private, with everyone paying for themselves, or free, where anyone can access it? Is there a middle ground?

I’m going to be sharing my personal opinion tonight, but please get the ball rolling!

A quick reminder to attack ideas and not people. Also, remember that this is all for fun! No matter how heated we get, I hope we can all keep the disagreements to this thread only. We’re all mature enough!

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I’m not all that educated on the NHS, but I believe it should be free, excluding plastic surgeries purely for aesthetics (but then is that really healthcare?). People shouldn’t have to pay to have healthy bodies. People shouldn’t be scared of going to the doctor in case they run out of money. In the UK, you don’t have to pay if you call an ambulance- apparently you do elsewhere? What if they’re seriously injured? What if they risk not going to the doctor and then die because they’re too scared of bankruptcy? I am interested to see other opinions though :thinking: I’ve never thought about this much.

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I think freetax pay as we have where I live. because private mean they can take this sky high prices they have in the US. healthcare should be to help people.people should not be worried about money when they go to the doctor to get help. I rather pay those 5% extra in tax and know that who need help get it. and know if I am in that situation I won’t have to worry about money.

please enjoy this picture it took me forever to find in my files

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Private healthcare is inherently selfish and actually pretty malicious. The whole idea is that you look out for ‘number one’. “I pay for my healthcare, so if somebody can’t, it’s just their fault isn’t it? Not my problem!” Yeah well good for you, you’re now no longer any fun at parties I’ll tell you that much.

What’s the point in society if everyone’s just out for themselves? Like not even their family, literally just themselves. Having free universal healthcare is the nicer, more positive and welcoming way to go about things. Using this system, everyone in a society covers each others’ backs. I don’t know why people have an issue with that, it sounds pretty lovely to me

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I’m on the fence at times only because I haven’t experienced it free.

I sometimes wonder about quality of healthcare if it is free. It’s better than nothing, so I’m not against it. But are there areas where people who can afford better health care can go?

Do doctors make a lot of money when healthcare is paid through taxes?

I had a friend in Canada say it’s harder to get into the doctor for certain things. Is that true?

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You ask some great questions! So I’ll answer them before I voice my opinion. Although it will probably become quite obvious as I go along!

Beware: I’m rather left wing with some socialist ideas, so my thoughts on this matter are influenced by that. Although I’ll try to be as factual and logical as possible!

Healthcare isn’t really free free in the UK. Or anywhere, for that matter. So the quality improves based on how much the government is willing to invest in it. That’s why there are so many strikes in the NHS at the moment! We have a conservative government that keep cutting the funding. When they cut the funding, hospitals have to cut staff to compensate. So there are more people per doctor. Fewer cleaners. Fewer nurses, etc. That raises waiting times and lowers standards.

The good thing about a free healthcare system is that patients aren’t treated like profit. There was a study recently that showed that doctors are far more likely to prescribe medicine and treatments that are unnecessary when they’re directly making money from those treatments. It’s a pretty obvious outcome, if you ask me. That’s human nature!

So in a lot of ways, having the doctors earn a fixed, meritocratic amount lowers the risk of overprescription, which improves quality. Doctors surgeries don’t spend time and money giving out invoices and trying to sell people treatments. Plus, since the government is funding the health services, the service providers have to make sure they meet government standards otherwise they’ll get their fundings cut and their fundings will be given to a higher performing hospital or practice.

In the UK, definitely! Most people don’t bother. They just use the NHS either way since it’s there and it’s good enough. However, there are two options for paying for healthcare.

  1. Getting “health insurance”. It’s not quite the same as it is in the US. It’s much more about going to private hospitals and paying a monthly fee to have access to those. When I was a kid before my other 500 siblings were born, my dad used to pay for BUPA for me. That’s a private healthcare system! It’s kinda supplementary to the NHS for a lot of people, to be honest. When I broke my wrist, I had BUPA, but I still went through the NHS because it’s good enough!

  2. Using the “private” options in the NHS. When you’re a student or a child, you can get glasses on the NHS up to £25 in cost. They’re nothing fancy! If you want designer options, you get the £25 off and then you pay for the rest yourself. When my mum gave birth to my little sister (she’s 3 now wut), she paid for a private room in UCLH so she wouldn’t have to deal with other mothers just after she gave birth. She could have got a semi-private or communal room on the NHS! And she got all of the services free. She just paid for the room like a hotel. In terms of dental care, you get normal silver fillings on the NHS. If you want the more aesthetic white fillings, you pay. If you have teeth that are so wonky they affect your speech or the way you eat or really look bad, you get braces on the NHS. If they’re just a little bit wonky, you have to pay to get them.

Would I say a lot? No. They don’t make as much as they could if they were selling their own treatments for the price they set. However, the NHS is under pressure to match the salaries of the private options so that doctors don’t up and leave. That keeps their salaries pretty high.

Doctors still earn well over the national average and minimum wage, and they get so many perks! Loads of businesses and services offer a discount for NHS services!

I already covered this, but it largely depends on how much the government spends on the healthcare. When I was a child, waiting times in the hospital were under an hour where I lived in London – and that’s for non-emergency. Of course, emergency patients get seen straight away. My nan recently had an operation on her knee. That took 3 months, but government cuts are largely to blame for that! Less doctors to do the services!

But when I was a child, I found out that I’m severely double-jointed throughout my body and it caused me flat feet and lower back problems. I got seen in 2 weeks. My aunty got diagnosed with cancer last year and she started chemo a week after she went to the hospital for her scan.

The issue is getting much bigger now thanks to the cuts, though!


My few comments on the US system:

  • There are quite a few people in America who don’t go to the hospital when they should because of the price. If you can’t affort sufficient healthcare and your job doesn’t offer you health insurance, you’re kinda screwed and you can go bankrupt to pay for getting cancer! The problem is a lot bigger than people make it out to be. Even health insurance, my family in America don’t use ambulances when they have an emergency because they still have to pay 20% of the costs of their hospital bill and they want to keep the prices as low as possible.

  • As well as it being positively disgusting to me that some people out there who can’t afford to be ill, there’s another big issue with this: it causes more health issues in society as a whole. If people are too scared to go to the hospital because it costs too much, then we’re allowing a lot of preventable diseases to spread. Just like the anti-vaxxers refusing to vaccinate their kids and causing a spread of disease, it affects everyone. Immunisation and treatment of the sick helps everyone else around them, too, and lowers the costs of healthcare in general. You know what they say! Prevention is better than treatment! And if we’re treating as many people with contagious diseases as possible, we’re stopping those people from spreading the diseases and causing more diease. If they’re sitting at home avoiding having to fork out money, disease can spread much easier.

  • America spends more per capita on defence than the next few (I wanna say 5 but it could be more) countries put together. And a lot of these countries are also at a great risk of security threats! If America put together a little more of that money for healthcare (the government actually spends a lot on health care as it is), they could give everyone a basic amount of care.

  • People like Trump who criticise free healthcare now have been recorded in the past talking about how good it is! I remember watching a video with him praising the speed and sanity of the NHS when he was in Scotland a few years ago.

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I meant hygiene! Sometimes I hate English: why isn’t the adjective of “sanitise” “sanity”?

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So many things to say… so little time (I have food coming :thinking::woman_shrugging:)
So I shall sum up my opinion in one word…

Free

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But not actually free if you have a job.

(Not against it, just saying.)

True! Although you’re gonna pay taxes either way! It just depends on what the government prioritises

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You pay taxes on much if you don’t have a job?
We do on some purchases.

We have VAT for most purchases, but that’s it really. Most people don’t notice it because we always get the price with tax included. That was a real culture shock for me when I went to the US and they’d tell me the price and it would be more expensive when I went to pay :joy:

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Yep and different in all states. We don’t pay taxes on food here. And 6% on other purchases.

VAT is 20% here! :grimacing: as is income tax for most people who aren’t rich. Surprisingly, goods still cost about the same!

Hmmmmm crazy.

Had to get all technical about it didn’tcha! :roll_eyes::woman_facepalming::joy::joy:

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I think healthcare should be free since most people can’t afford private unless some people abuse the system. Not too sure on where to begin since I have been going to these eating disorder clinics (they’re all free) and other things so I’m too ignorant on this topic :sweat_smile:

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If we get free healthcare, how does it work?

So, in Canada, we have free healthcare, so we don’t have to pay to see our family doctor or go to the hospital, but we still have to pay for services like the dentist, which can be covered by insurance.